trans_9 | Probatur, ut to order, futurus veritas

Superman was one of the first to arrive, most of which was made easy via his flying ability. He had a lot on his mind since his argument with Nanoha and his talk with Kon. For the moment, he would wait until they got to that point.

He couldn't help but be impressed with the choice for the meeting - it was no Watchtower, but impressive none the less. As well, it did serve its purposes.

Kang hadn't been able to help admiring the construction of the building when he'd first shown up; as a former engineer, he could easily see the amount of work and detail that had gone into it.

He had picked one of the more sturdy chairs, one that didn't have arms to trap his wings, and for the time being, he was content to lean back in his seat and wait for the others to show after nodding in greeting to Superman. He knew there would be arguments, and he wasn't much looking forward to them. Unfortunately, they always accompanied politics.

Matt walked in next and quietly sat down in a chair his size. Folding his hands in front of his lips, he leaned back and assumed a "sleeping" position, but was clearly in thought of what they were all going to discuss.

Matt did his best thinking when he was relaxed, and his slouched posture showed. A sort of thinking man at any rate. He opened his left eye however and locked a gaze with Kal and Kang, giving them his silent approval of them being there and early.

Kang wasn't the only one who couldn't help but appreciate the beauty of the place, but when Wanda reached the room she quickly turned her attention to her fellow Councilors, nodding. "Hello. I've met some of you but I don't know how you would prefer to be addressed here."

Roy is close on Wanda's tail, walking in a minute or two after her, hands in the pockets of his greatcoat. His eyes swivel around the room curiously, fixing for several seconds on the four other Councilors already present, affording them a respectful nod if they happened to make eye contact with him.

Having missed Wanda's request for introduction, he chooses to remain silent and thoughtful, settling into a free chair as he likewise settled into his old mindset of potentially harsh pragmatism.

Luke was next. He'd put on the handmade robes that Arha had given him; they reminded him of his first friend here. More than that, they reminded him of the importance of this station he'd been granted. Locating a free chair, he took a seat.

"Nice to meet all of you face to face finally," he said with a smile to each in turn. "I'm Luke Skywalker."

Look out behind you, Luke; A darkness approaches.

"Council members," Lex greeted politely, then took a seat. He did have some business with them today.

Wanda started. "Mr. Luthor? What are you doing here?"

Geoffrey Chaucer was never late to the party, or at very least was rarely late. Quite often he was the one announcing it, after all. This time, however, he'd taken his time getting to the meeting, dawdling in an effort to get used to the pure Frenchness of the building they'd chosen and let everyone else settle in.

The other council members' reasons be damned; he'd voted for this location precisely for its drama.

So a bit of Mr. Luthor's drama might have been stolen as he sauntered in with a "M'lords, m'ladies," and agilely slid into a chair, feet immediately propping atop the table.

If he had an apple, he'd be crunching on it.

Kon, Fate, Mei-Xing and Lex get to say their piece, before the council decides.

Lex, clearly dressed in his Sunday best, stood up and stepped forward before the Council. He had been asked to go first, and while he would rather have gone later, this giving him time to refine his speech a bit, he was still ready.

"Ladies and Gentlemen of the Council, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to speak. For the record, my name is Alexander J. Luthor. On my world, I'm owner and CEO of LuthorCorp, the largest and most successful Research and Development firm on the planet. Under my leadership, my company done a great deal of research and exploration into a number of scientific fields, making significant advances in many of them. This includes the field of cloning, which is why I'm before you today. I've taken a look at the clone, and I'm here to present you my findings. I'm not here on behalf of Mei-Xing, nor am I here on behalf of the clone. I am here in the interest of justice, to help you arrive at a fair and impartial decision. After all, to do that, you do need a solid, factual basis to be the foundation of your opinion.

"That being said, facts without any context aren't terribly useful either. But, hopefully when I'm done, you'll have a clearer view of the reality of the situation."

Pausing for a moment, having completed his opening statement, Lex went back towards his seat. He retrieved his omnicomm, placed it face up on a nearby table, and tapped a few buttons on it. Several large holographic screens popped out at different angles, ensuring that everyone in the room had a good view of what was on them. In this case, it wasn't medical scans, but a certain document was scrolling before them. It stopped at a particular section, and highlighted the first few lines.

"Now, to give you some context." Lex motioned towards the screen. "I'm sure you all recognize the ship's constitution. If you notice the highlighted section, it reads No member of the crew may be arrested, charged with, tried for, and imprisoned for any crime they committed on their homeworld prior to joining the crew. Regardless as to whether or not the crime was committed against current crew members.

"I bring this up because, as I understand the matter at hand, Mei-Xing is the legal owner of the clone in question, and the Council is here to decide whether she continues to be its legal owner. How or Why she came into possession of the clone, and the ethics of such, is not what will be decided on today. Due to the fact that all of that happened on Mei-Xing's homeworld, and, as it is my understanding of the law, it is therefore not under your jurisdiction to judge that matter. As such, while I was able to discover a great deal about the development of the clone, I will not be delving into those matters, nor is much of that information in my full report. However, if the Council feels that information is pertinent, I will provide it.

"I say that, not to remind you of what your job is. I'm sure you're all well aware of that. But I did feel the need to let you know how I interpreted what information was relevant to the matter at hand."

Lex tapped his omnicomm again, and the screen scrolled up.

"Now to finally get to the matter at hand, whether or not Mei-Xing should retain ownership of the clone. Now, if we look again at the Constitution, specifically, the Bill of Rights, you'll note that Article I Section 1 states Sentient dignity shall be inviolable. To respect and protect it shall be the duty of all state authority. Article II Section 2 states that Freedom of the Sentient shall be inviolable. Article III Section 1 states that All Sentients shall be equal before the law.

"The Constitution clearly and specifically places sentience as being the main requirement to be legally considered a person, legally considered a member of the crew, and guaranteed the full rights as any other crew member. This is obviously because of the rather diverse nature of the crew we have. We have a number of crew members who are completely inorganic, including AI's, a synthezoid, and even sentient plastic action figure. We also have a number of non-humanoid crew members, including a sentient house cat. Bottom line is that no one is granted rights by merely being a member f a certain species. They must be sentient. Which, of course, brings us to the obvious question:

"Is the clone sentient?"

Lex decided to insert a short pause here for dramatic effect.

"No," he stated quietly. "It is not. For every scan I could take, and every test I could possibly run searching for even the faintest sign of sentience, this clone failed. Miserably. It is not at all sentient. It never was sentient. It never will become sentient.

The screens switched again, this time showing several maps and scans of the clone's brain.

"The clone exists in what can best be described as a permanent coma. There are no higher brain functions active. There's no consciousness, there isn't even a subconscious mind active. The only part of the brain that is active is here," it was a very small area that was highlighted on the screen, "which controls all the autonomic functions, and only barely at that. Take it off life support, and it won't last long. But as long as its hooked up to the machines, the clone can breathe, it heart beats, its body can absorb nutrients and expel waste, and its menstrual cycle has gone uninterrupted.

"Just to compare, any living single-celled organism can do the exact same things. It can absorb oxygen through its cellular membrane, circulate it around its cell, absorb nutrients, expel waste, and reproduce. It, however, can't do anything more than that, and neither can this clone.

"A new born human baby, even a baby born a month or two premature, it can still move its arms and legs, open its eyes, it can cry, it can feel pain. This clone is forever incapable of doing any one of those things."

He paused again, just to let that bit of information settle in, so they could think on it.

"Now, just to clear up some possible confusion, the clone is not 'brain dead,' nor is it 'brain damaged,' at least if we're going by clinical definition. To be brain dead, that would require either some or all of the clone's brain tissue to be, obviously, dead. None of the clone's brain tissue is dead. For the clone to be brain damaged, that would require some kind of damage or deformation in the brain that would hinder its function. However, none of its brain tissue has suffered any damage, scarring, deformations, or trauma. All of its brain tissue is remarkably healthy, likely because 99% of it has never been used.

"For all intents and purposes, this clone is a non-sentient organic lifeform. There is, frankly, no other way for me to classify it. That is the harsh reality of the situation. Whether or not Mei-Xing should retain ownership of it, that is your decision to make. But I do hope my information has helped to give you a clearer picture of what you're deciding on. Thank you for listening."

Edited 2010-09-29 00:14 (UTC)

Mei-Xing listens to Luthor speak with half a mind. The other half is spent examining the other members of the Council on the astral plane, taking note of their emotional reactions. She has to give Luthor credit, he's terrible at delivering the goods, but the man can give a speech.

Before entering, she'd wrapped two spells around herself. The first shifted the plantsuit around, turning it into a professional-looking business suit with a skirt, doing the best she could do to create the illusion of layers when she only had the one plantsuit to work with. It ended up rather well, though she'd prefer the real deal. The second was just to touch up her looks some, cleansing her skin and giving her hair a more business-like look to it. She knew the effect would be lost on most of the people there, but if she managed to look professional in front of at least one of the Council and sway their decisions...

When he wraps up she stands and gives him a courteous nod, taking her place in front of the Council. "Good day, honorable members of the Council. For the record, I go by Mei-Xing. On my world I am a shadowrunner, a member of the darker side of society. I'll freely admit to it, I'm a criminal." She clasps her hands behind her back. "I accept money from corporations or concerned citizens to do steal, to plant evidence, to move corporate assets undetected. I won't go into all of the details because the only part that matters is that you understand that I live a very dangerous lifestyle."

"In my world, we do have cyberware, mechanical replacements and enhancements for body parts. They're cheaper than a clone. They're more useful. But, ultimately, they're more dangerous. You see, in my world, there is an energy that runs through every living thing. We call this 'mana'. In metahuman people, and some Awakened animals, we use the term 'essence', because it literally is the essence of our lives."

She places her omnicomm down, then taps into it with her head unit, blinking her eyes into Augnented Reality so she can more easily manipulate the holoprojector. Tapping the air as if working on a keyboard, she brings up humanoid figure with glowing lines flowing through its body (http://www.rickrichards.com/chakras/chakra_man1.jpg).

"Many branches of magic call this 'chakra' rather than essence. The concept is similar. Your life force flows through your body, maintaining a healthy balance. However, when you're shoving new and interesting things into your body, it tends to disrupt the flow of energy." She shoves her hand through the center of the hologram's chest, and the energy lines grow jagged, breaking in some places. "Mechanical parts, even some vat-grown body parts, disrupt the delicate balance, and seriously damage your essence. As you can guess, if it's damaged too greatly, you die." She pauses, then clears her throat. "This is bad."

"Essence doesn't matter overmuch to normal metahuman society. You go around my world, you'll see plenty of humans, elves, trolls, orks, and dwarves with cybernetic arms, legs, or eyes, among the least outstanding pieces of cyberware you can get. However, to an Awakened person such as myself, it's extremely dangerous. Our very magical ability depends on having a strong balance of energies in our bodies, because we pull mana from the planet and through our bodies in order to shape magic."

She twists her fingers, shifting the hologram to form two new humanoid figures, both with auras. One is hazy, but still bright with energy, and the other blazes like a flame. "As you can guess, the level of essence in our bodies determines how much power we can put into our spells. If you slide in a bunch of machinery, cutting off the energy flow in the body, you damage the magical potential of the recipient." She closes her fist and the blazing figure fades to the level of a match.

"Now, I know some of you will say that the ability to use magic doesn't condone making a clone for organ donation. But it's not just the ability to use magic that mages gain. With it, I can access a whole other world, the astral plane."

She pauses again. She'd run through this many times in her head, and she still didn't know how to phrase it well for the Council, a group of mundanes. "Think of it as another set of senses entirely. I step into it and look at you. I can see your auras, your souls, your spirits, whatever you want to call them. I know what emotions you feel, how strongly you feel it. I know how healthy you are. I can see the energies that flow through a world, hear the sounds of the planet, see the emotions tied with a place and the spirits that linger in..."

She catches herself and holds a hand to her face, shaking her head. "Sorry. Got a little carried away." She lowers her hand, composed again. "This world and the astral world are close at times. A mage's senses are constantly catching bleed through from the astral realm. To lose this is a horrific thing, many go insane or kill themselves after burning out from too many enhancements. I've heard it described as touching everything through gloves, hearing everything through ears stuffed with cotton, and seeing everything through a desaturization filter."

She snaps her fingers, shutting off the omnicomm. "That's why I had the clone made. My own organs would never damage my body like this, and cloning individual body parts takes weeks to do. Far too long for major trauma. Was I surprised when I found the tank here? Yes. Should I have reported it as soon as I saw it? I should have. That was my error, and I would have rectified it as soon as I saw it here. I now know the fact that Stacy is capable of cloning parts in a matter of hours, but before that, all I had seen was cybernetic replacements, like the ones the boys named Paco and Hiccup wear. You understand my nervousness on that part now."

She collects her omnicomm again, scanning its screen before tucking it close to her side. "I won't go over the brawl that ended up in my imprisonment. You have the security reports, even a video recording. You saw me attack the two... concerned citizens after being threatened. I don't have anything to add to that event, and I don't believe it really plays a part in this hearing. Nor do I have anything to add to Mr. Luthor's statements that the clone barely functions. As he has stated, it is little more than a plant."

"In closing, all I have to say is that the clone is mine. It's never going to be anything more than it is now. I had it made knowing that. And while I am told that Stacy can clone parts within a few hours, this is a resource that is already here. And, frankly, after hearing how she's made so many mistakes, and how damaged she is, I'd rather trust doctors that are members of metahumanity, and a clone that I'm already carrying a lung from." Why try something new and possibly dangerous when she has something she already knows works perfectly?

"I trust all of you to make a proper decision. That is all. Thank you for your time." She gives them another nod, then heads for her seat.

The third person to stand was Fate. She, too, was dressed formally, in a black outfit Rein had made to resemble her Enforcer uniform. The single light pink ribbon in her hair probably clashed with the dark uniform, but Fate didn’t care; Nanoha couldn’t be here with her, so she had taken a reminder of the other girl with her for support.

Her face was a mask of calm as she approached the council, but just under it, her emotions were threatening to overwhelm her. Between hearing Lex’s full report, and the still lingering shock that this even had to be seriously discussed… well. This was definitely going to be a long meeting.

“Hello, ladies and gentlemen. I am Lieutenant Fate Testarossa Harlaown, and I thank you for giving me the chance to speak today.” She said, inclining slightly in a bow of respect. Her voice, like her expression, was calm, giving no hint to her inner turmoil.

“I’m not a scientist. I can’t comment at all on the state of that girl… but I do know that she’s not needed. Stacy can grow organs in a matter of hours, correct? If Mei-Xing was hurt on a mission, Stacy could easily grow whatever organ was needed during the time it takes to return to the ship. And if she was somehow critically injured on the ship, well… is there a way to preserve organs in the Med Bay?” Fate paused, taking a breath to keep herself calm as she continued.

“Say we do let her keep the clone. What happens when her organs run out? Say she injures a lung, and the clone doesn’t have either of hers…” Again, Fate had to pause. She was disgusted that she was even thinking about that. “If we can just grow a new lung for her, that defeats the purpose of her clone, and it would mean we wasted a life.

And just as important as that is the effect this will have on some of our crewmates.” Her mask was beginning to falter, and she frowned a little.

“There are several clones on board, myself included. “ She placed a hand on her chest. “If the other crew members find out about this incident, it’s probably going to hurt them badly. I can’t speak for all the clones on board, but I know several people who have struggled for years trying to prove that they’re people, and not copies. If they find out about this about this, how do you think this is going to affect them? To hear that someone is allowed to consider their clone property just because they created them… it’s going to bring up questions they’ve been trying not to ask themselves for a long time.” It was obvious now that Fate was speaking from personal experience, and her emotional mask was slipping a little more.

“Like the others, I trust all of you to make the right decision. But you must keep in mind that this decision shouldn’t be made merely based on scientific fact or a matter of ownership. You also need to keep in mind that you aren’t just deciding on one clone in this one instance. Whatever is said here is going to set a precedent for any cases like this in the future, and this could be very dangerous.” Fate finished. She wanted to say more, but she had to remind herself that Kon still needed to speak. This meeting was just as important to him as it was to her, so she trusted him to mention what she didn’t.

So, with another bow, and another “thank you”, she turned on her heel, returning to her seat.

Kon was looking down at the floor as he stood up, thoughtful, and didn't looked at Mei-Xing or Luthor--or even fate. When he got to the podium, he placed his omnicom in front of him and placed his hands to the sides carefully, and gripped them for a moment.

Unlike the others, he wasn't really dressed fancy. He was in his standard "S" T-shirt (that he'd gotten made at Zokez) and jeans.

It took a second for him to start, but when he finally took a deep breath and let it out, and looked up, there was an expression of resolve on his face that made him almost the mirror image of his mentor when said mentor was in 'save-the-day' mode. Looking back at his omnicom, he started.

"When I was cloned, I was aged up very quickly. I went from a clump of cells to a teenager in about a week. That made it impossible for my brain to develop, and the tech at Cadmus, the facility that cloned me, had to do a lot of stuff to prod my brain into working. Since I'd never used the damn thing, they introduced programming--basic knowledge, social knowledge, all that to it, arooound I guess when I was physically 12 or 13 maybe. That's when I remember the start of it anyway and that's how old I looked. I think."

A deep breath.

"Do I recommend doing that for the clone? Well, actually no. We don't know if we can, a lot can go wrong, and aside from that, I had a whole grab bag of issues from that programming and having my mind formed for me rather than developing it with age--everything from arrogant, evil megalomaniac supervillains using that to control me to identity issues that I still struggle with today."

"But my point is that, at one point, I was in the same state as Mei-Xing's clone. My brain was there, it was healthy, but I wasn't doing anything but floating useless in a tube, at first. Clones are often not...like normal people in our stages of development, that's the part I'm trying to impress here. When you've got someone playing mad scientist, they don't always pay attention to the fiddly bits like proper neural development or whether or not the clone can survive out in the open air without their skin turning to chalk. That means that clones sometimes develop in strange steps, or are undeveloped, or shoot off into a developmental dead end, usually because of the callousness and cruelty of people who only intend to use them for something."

"Now Luthor is quick to point out that Mei Xing shouldn't be punished for what she did in her world--and you know what? I agree. The law is the law. But she had a clone made, developed in a way that it's capacity for sentience was damaged by the process itself, and did this knowingly. If she had done this with a child created by normal sexual reproduction and grabbed it out of the womb before it'd started to really develop, and aged it up so it was in the same state as this clone, where it grew too fast for its brain to keep up, to have its organs plucked out, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now. We'd call it a travesty and be worrying about how best to deal with this poor kid's condition, and what's best for them, even if we weren't punishing her or whatever."

"That's the biggest problem I have with this. Is the clone sentient? No. Should it have been? Yes. It was developed in a way that even if it wasn't intentionally developmentally disabled, it just didn't matter to its creators if it was. What happened in its creation was a horrific process. It shouldn't be allowed to ever be imitated on board, but on that token, even if Mei-Xing shouldn't be punished, the rewards from this process shouldn't be allowed to be enjoyed. It is a very small step from letting someone use a clone's organs to allowing someone to create a similar clone. After all, if it's legal to benefit from this, if you deem the clone has no rights, then why can't others make similar clones, if they have no rights? You've already condoned their use. What's the difference between use and creation if you've already decided that a creation like this isn't a sentient and doesn't deserve protection? I have worked shutting down rotten cloning operations--trust me, it is a slippery slope you do not want to go down. It's an easy slope to go down."

"And also, okay, even if we argue that living creatures can be possessions? Does that mean that someone can torture and murder their own dog on board? Cause non-sentient creatures pain just for the hell of it? I know we don't have laws in place, but my point is that my freakin' dog Bitey should not have more rights than the clone of a person, and as it stands, he probably does."

"As for the organ argument, I have weird organs I can't live without. A lot of people do. If Mei-Xing is that worried about having cloned organs immediately on hand, she can arrange with Stacy to have them already in wait and on ice or otherwise kept preserved so they're ready for immediate implantation. And if she's worried about her quality, she can have the doctors check them over to make sure they'll work okay. There's nothing to stop her from stockpiling. And if you don't believe me, well..."

"Hey Stacy! Is what I just said true?"

||Yes, Kon-El.||

Kon just raised his eyebrows at Mei-Xing and Lex, as if to say 'What, am I the only one who thought to ask?'

"In the end, it all comes three things: need, precedent, and compassion. Is there need for Mei-Xing to keep this clone or even use its organs when she has many other options available, including stockpiling ahead of time? No. Would using this clone for that set bad precedent? Uh, yes. For both consent issues when someone is incapable of giving consent and for the use and creation of clones. And then most important of all: Is letting this clone be used as an organ bag compassionate? Whether that's in life or in death?"

He looked up at them all, his face pleading.

"Well, is it? Look at the poor thing's life. Bam, you've got the start of life and she grows and she grows and then when people are developing and seeing the world around them, she has nothing, and she grows, and it's still nothing, and then she grows too fast, and it's more nothing, and then... she is what she is. It doesn't matter to anyone that she never had a chance. It doesn't matter to anyone that she was grown in a way that deprived her of a real life, of thinking and feeling and deciding who she is. We call something damage when there was something there to get damaged in the first place, but how's it not cruel to deny someone the chance to grow and develop in the first place to use their body? Maybe that shouldn't be punished, sure, if it happened off-ship--but why should that be rewarded?"

"The law should be tempered by compassion, and the compassionate thing here is to decide what's best for the clone, if not out of respect of what she is, than out of respect for what she should have been. I don't know what's right for her, but I do know that she deserves to have the least amount of suffering possible. She deserves the dignity that was never afforded her. If you all decide she should be pulled off the life support or something, I can't even argue that--as long as people aren't allowed to peck away at her organs like vultures, 'cause that's not dignity. That's letting what should have been a person be treated like a thing."

Kon took one last deep breath.

"Because in the end, clones are always created for a purpose. It's our nature. We are treated like we're not people, and that we're property, that our organs or other parts of ourselves belong to other people. We're told we're not individuals or that we're soul-less or that we're not thinking for ourselves, only programmed. I'm luckier than some because my purpose needed higher thinking skills and allowed me some freedom--and because the person I was cloned from looked after me and was my friend from the start--"

He looked at Superman gratefully.

"--but most clones are lucky if they can even think above the third-grade level and don't have an extra arm coming out of their crotch. Hell, most are lucky if they even survive the cloning process itself, or can think after it, something, unfortunately, that Mei Xing's clone is a casualty of."

He added bluntly, "And it sucks. To be used. To be treated like a thing. To be made to be used."

"Please. Please make that different here. Taking away Mei-Xing's clone to do what's best for it, whatever that is, isn't punishment when the organs can be replaced by Stacy--and even stockpiled, it's just respecting life, and preventing an insidious practice from having the tiniest bit of leeway from edging into our legal system. Because you can't say it's okay to use a clone because they're not sentient and also say it's not okay to make an unsentient clone to be used, not with any legitimacy. Using life that was created to be used and creating life to be used are intertwined. It's not possible to separate the two."

Kon swallowed.

"And that's all I have to say."

Once those asked to present testimony to the Council had finished, and he'd had a few moments to organize his thoughts, Luke leaned forward. He'd never been much of a speechmaker; growing up on Tatooine as a farmboy hadn't exactly made him the eloquent one, not like his sister. But he would do his best.

"I've said before that where I'm from, we've had some experiences with clones," he said. "In our case they were usually soldiers, clones of those with the kinds of abilities that were deemed useful. And that's just how they were thought of by some - useful, and in the end, expendable. But others didn't see it that way. The Jedi, for example, did what they could to make sure that the clone soldiers under their command in the Clone Wars were taken care of and respected."

He took a deep breath. "Most clones were engineered to grow up quickly, and that kind of accelerated aging process meant that methods such as flash-learning were used to essentially download information from a template mind into the mind of the clone." Visions of Thrawn's clone, in the Spaarti cylinder on Nirauan, swam up to the fore of his mind. "Before that process, most clones wouldn't have even been taken out of the cloning tanks. They wouldn't have been able to function.

"But that doesn't mean they wouldn't be alive. My calling has always been to preserve and honor life as best I can, and I can't in good conscience say that a being doesn't deserve that same treatment just because they're dependent on machines for sustaining their life. And just because they're not cognizant right now doesn't mean they can't become that way. It's not a good thing to start doing, thinking of living beings in terms of usefulness, or that they're anyone's property.

"Out of respect for the other members of the crew who are clones, and based on my own thoughts on all this, I suggest we take care of Mei-Xing's clone as best we can, and keep her from being used for repairs, so to speak. Stacy's said pretty clearly she can take care of things if there's a call for something the clone would normally provide."

He sat back, breathing a silent sigh of relief.

Wanda took a deep breath and when she spoke her voice was calm and level, though it was clear from the look on her face that she found the subject highly unsettling. "From what I understand, based on Mr. Luthor's testimony, the clone can never gain sentience, basic understanding of its surroundings, or even have any basic thoughts. I'm also concerned about life, but I'm not certain if the clone could be considered alive. Does she have a soul? It doesn't sound like she does, or ever could.

"Now, I don't think Mei-Xing should be able to use the clone. Stacy can provide any organs she might need, and letting her use the clone's would set a precedent. Even if we said that no one was allowed to do it, giving her an exception would be unfair and look poorly. It might encourage others to ignore the ruling."

"I, and every other adult individual of my race, are clones. We were created in a different manner than the ones most of you are used to; dark magic was used to warp the eggs of metallic dragons to hatch us instead. We were meant to be weapons in a war, shock troops. The Dragonarmies had originally intended for us to be smart enough to be able to fight better than goblins, but still be tractable, and much to their dismay, we surpassed that," Kang began, wings rustling.

"Now, I have not and will not lie to anyone on this ship about my past, or who and what I and my kind are. Our side murdered, stole, and worse, and we willingly went along with it. It was the only life we knew, and we'd been raised to think that we were doing the right thing. Not only that, but we had been told that no females had ever been created, or would be, to keep us under their control; decades later, we found out that was a lie. Partway into the war, most of the dragon eggs that hadn't been warped yet were recovered by the other side, and the Dragonarmies needed more soldiers.

"One of the three that had worked the spells to create us also made an artifact, called the Heart of Dracart, that took the soul of an existing draconian and split it, making hundreds of copies. Unfortunately, these clones were, to put it bluntly, stupid, were not capable of magic or any of the abilities each type of us possesses, and didn't have a life span much longer than three years. Before Dracart got the chance to use it, the war was lost."

Kang crossed his arms over his chest. "Most of us only knew of this artifact through rumors, and were unaware of all the details of what it did. A little over a year after we had found the females, and had raised them, one of our kind decided to use it. He wanted slaves to follow him, nothing more, and he planned on killing the girls, as well. He was killed before he could use it on too many of the men."

"I pitied them. They always had a lost look in their eyes, and if I had ordered any one of them to kill himself, he would have, with no hesitation, due to the strict obedience training they'd undergone. I had hopes that these draconians would one day regain what they'd lost, so I allowed them in Teyr. They never did. To this day, I wonder if I should have just had them all killed, out of mercy."

He took a breath, "So you can see that I've had more than my share of experience with clones, and why I'm uncomfortable with the idea of anymore like Mei-Xing's being created. However, we must remember that this clone already exists, and that in this particular case, it will never do anything more than lie in one spot, unconscious. It will never speak, or even open its eyes of its own volition. This was done purposely, yes, but the point is, and one that Mr. Luthor made as well, that it is not sentient, and that is what is important. It is that lack of sentience, despite its physical appearance, that makes it unequal."

"I want to make it clear: while I am of the opinion that Mei-Xing should be able to keep the clone as an organ donor, I am against any further clones being created in such a manner. In any manner, really. Once it can no longer provide any parts she may need for her magic to operate properly, Stacy can then grow them and keep them in storage. If it is decided that she is not allowed to keep it, then I would rather it be destroyed than left hooked to the machines."

And then the bozak paused.

"There is one other thing we must remember, regarding Schmuz, Iniss, and yeerks as a species. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe yeerks need an organic brain to interface with, so creating an inorganic body for them to inhabit won't suffice, unless an organic brain is cloned. That goes right back to the issue currently at hand; the decision we make about Mei-Xing's clone will affect their chances at having a body to call their own, without sharing or taking over another person's. We may, in an effort to ensure that every sentient aboard this ship is guaranteed a body of their own without infringing on the rights of other sentients, have to allow things that we are not comfortable with. It's a difficult choice to make, and no matter what we choose, someone is going to be unhappy. Unfortunately, that comes with our job."

Superman listened to what the other Councilmen had to say. So far, it was pretty much split. He let out a sigh as he went to speak.

"I'm going to admit something - I've never dealt with this sort of thing. At least not in this sort of magnitude. Cloning and Kryptonian DNA is hard. Before and after Kon, I've dealt with clones of me that literally disintegrated in mind and body." He was referring to the first two Bizarros that his Luthor had created. All that so Luthor could have something of him. "As it stood, though, they were still living and I had to protect them from both themselves and those around them."

"However, this isn't the case. What we're dealing with here, if what we heard is right, is nothing more than an organ bank. And that, I feel, we can't allow to keep going. As everyone's said, Stacy can take care of her needs, she doesn't need to use something this inhumane. At the same time, though..." he let out a sigh and sat back. "...I am abstaining from deciding what becomes of the clone itself."

Sorry, Kon. Sorry, Fate. Getting involved in this from the get-go has made him a bit weary of wanting to make a choice.

Kang quirked an eyebrow ridge, "Inhumane, Councilor?"

Superman looked at Kang and noticed that he tread a mark he wasn't supposed to.

"My apologies." he said. "Allow me to rephrase it: something this cruel."

Yeah, this was going to be tougher than he thought. There was WAY too many toes on this ship that could be stepped on.

"Regardless of race," said Matt, finally coming out of his meditative pose and giving Kal and Kang a look, "This is a decision that makes up the whole of the council and we shouldn't quibble over things such as our genetic makeup."

Sitting up further, the young man finally seemed to have made a decision on his own opinion. "While in truth we have a comatose clone which will never regain sentience, and no matter how strongly we feel towards certain aspects of it, the fact remains that what we decide here will also impact the Yeerk decision."

"As such, after pondering options, I've been thinking on the matter while everyone offered opinions, and I will now offer my own on the matter."

Matt took a breath and let it out slowly. "I agree with Kang on both matters, as such Mei Xing should not keep the clone in the best interests of preserving rights of the people involved in this conflict and full clones should not be created in the sake of equal rights. However, we should also look into viable options for the Yeerks and their hosts. As such..." And Matt sighed. "As such, I believe we should ensure the protection of their interests, as well as the crew. I believe we should support the clone on life support until the time comes that it passes from the state it is in, but look into creating an artificial form for the Yeerks to inhabit, thus, using the clone for study in a model that could benefit both host and Yeerk and the interests of those involved."

Elfangor had listened quietly, having only returned very shortly before the meeting. Really, he was coming in mostly blind. He knew of one of the issues to be addressed, but that was later.

And listening now...

< There are races in the universe that depend upon clones for their own survival, to continue their race. I would never condone the life of one who is sentient being destroyed, but when there is no sentience, that is a different matter. >

He paused. It was true. For the moment, they have not come across the issue, but the Pod Caverns and the Universe were quite vast. At some point, there may very well be a time that a person would come from a species where clones weren't a convenience, but a necessity.

< I have faith in the crew to be able to tell the difference and being able to defend their crew mates should someone not be able to. Even for the emotional side, the plan suggested for the Yeerks came from one of the younger crew members who, herself, is a clone. >

< I would not condone this to be a common practice. However, for the rare occasions it is an issue, it should be a viable option given that it's monitored heavily to be sure there is no harm to what could be a sentient creature. But in this instance, should Mei Xing be able to gain from Stacy as she can from the clone, then it should either be given a 'merciful' death or kept on life support. If she can't and it's the only truly effective way to protect her sentient life, then it should be used for it's intended purposes. >

Iniss/Tom, and Sam/Schmuz speak their piece as well.

In a great many ways, this meeting was something he'd been dreading since the moment Jake had outed his existence on the comms. It was one thing to play it safe and keep his connections with Nightwing and Dani to protect him from normal crew mates.

It was another to face down the entire council for reasons unknown.

His stance could best be described as military rest, one hand holding his other wrist, face impassive despite the tension and niggling fear he was currently feeling.

Tom was, for once, blessedly silent, watchful in the back of his mind.

He didn't speak, waiting to be questioned.

"Sorry I'm late."

He's not, not really, but it doesn't hurt to look busy, and it's not an act. Allen IS busy. Punctuality is for politicians.

Considering he hasn't seen Tom or Iniss since before he became GLADOS' favorite plaything, it's been a while, so he glances over at the pair as he settles into his seat.

A tiny part of Iniss relaxed, glancing at the other with something that at any other time might have been warmth and welcome. He was a little too tense to really let either emotion show, but the slight softening of his features probably indicated he was at least feeling somewhat friendly towards Allen.

He was glad to see Allen. Glad that he at least had one ally here, even if that would likely be outweighed by the fact that Elfangor himself was here.

But Dani trusted Allen, and Iniss trusted Dani. Allen had been willing to go along with the plan and knew the details. This was better.

He'd rather not be here at all, but this was better.

Sam looked up and nodded to Allen with a bit of a smile. It was still him in control. Schmuz and him and decided that he was better versed in public speaking and would be able to speak to the Council better.

Still, that small bit of a smile was strained. Too many things could go wrong here.

And Dani is rushing in. "Sorry...! I just got free of GLADOS." And didn't get any cake.

She looked around, but it didn't look like she missed the important part, so hurries on over to Tom and Allen. "They haven't decided yet, right?"

Iniss' face relaxed into a true smile, breath escaping in a sigh. "Dani. No, they haven't decided yet, I think we're only just getting started. They're still deciding one of the other matters. Thank you for coming. Did GLADOS hurt you?"

Concern, because much had happened without her here, and it worried him. "Are you well?"

"Nah. I just didn't get the cake I was promised," Dani said. She was seriously miffed about that.

"I'm fine. You feeling okay?" She asked, sitting down next to him.

"We really should do something about that computer system lying about cake." He sighed, offering her a small grimace.

"I'm fine, just tense. Things like this, ah. Hopefully it will be over soon. I'm glad you're here." He smiled, feeling a great deal better now that she was. If nothing else, if things went wrong, Dani could get them out.

Surely that was the only reason he was glad to see her?

"Yeah. It's really mean," Dani said with a frown.

Dani smiled. "We'll find a way to help you, no matter what happens."

Probatur, ut to order, futurus veritas

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Mei-Xing's Clone

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Yeerk Issue

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Mandatory Physicals and Psychiatric Evaluations

Council Chairperson